Is it a roller?

Can a reasonable guess be derived about whether a '12 GRiSO is a flat tappet or roller cam bike based on the VIN? I asked the seller if he could tell me the build date, and he replied with the VIN (which is already on the ad...).

From what I've read here, the changeover was in mid-'12 production. So we're ther many bikes that were sold as 2012 models in the US with factory roller cams?

Nope. You need to peek under the valve cover.

That's what I feared.  It's a low mileage bike (less than 4,000 miles), on ebay right now for $8,000 with no bids and ~10 hours left.  

I'm not ready to pull the trigger yet anyway, but if the seller still has it come spring, should I ask that he have it inspected for tappet wear and photographed?  

If it's a flat tappet bike, I'm not sure it's worth the $8,000 ask - since I'd be spending a little over a thousand more for the roller conversion kit regardless (unless I can get Piaggio to foot the bill, but then I have to find a decent dealer and pay them the labor, as I doubt Piaggio would just give ME the parts).

Good morning from Cross Junction.

A few "FWIW" comments.

First, I view Winchester Motorsports as way better than a "decent dealer."  

Their primary tech -- Mike #1 (Mike #2 is the parts guy who, to my amazement, will meet or beat every on-line deal I've challenged him on -- is a very competent wrench.  He will soon have at least one "rollerization" under his belt, and he understands all the techniques Pete and others here have voiced about that process.

Second and sadly, I was unable to make a deal on my brother's Norge, as that would have provided you the complete engine swap for less lira than some other options.

Third, for some background on that particular GRiSO beyond the ad, you might take a look here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

From his other posts there (have seen none here), Eric seems like a good guy.  Wondering if his Tenni never met his suspension expectations or his memories of his prior one?  He may also have just been (understandably) turned off by the whole "roller" piece.  Given his effusive comments about his earlier GRiSO, the low mileage sale is odd.

Fourth, and perhaps most importantly, you might just ask him (off line if doable) if that one has flat or roller tappets.  Suspect he knows. Saw that you asked him build date and he replied with VIN. I'd be up front and let him know you know about the issue and see how he responds.

Fifth, the Weber grill looks silly on the back.  

Good luck with your continuing "hunt."

Bill

Thanks for the inside scoop, Bill. When I posed the question, I framed it in the context of flat tappet or roller. He answered in the not-completely-committal "almost certain" it was converted, but call Dave at MI to double-check.

Not worth wasting any more of anyones time at this point to inquire further, since I'm not in a position to buy. I'd be curious to check it out, being a short 2-hour drive from here to there, but curiosity is all I can offer until I lock in my post-retirement job

Understand all.

Can't recall if you've even ridden a GRiSO, but (obviously after mine returns and the weather improves), you are welcome to come out and ride mine around.  I'll "chaperone" on the Norge ... well, if I ever get back together again! ... or the EV.

I say that about a "demo" ride as the GRiSO calls to all here, but it is a different enough beast that one romp might be enough to say never again.  Or not, as in hooked to the point you'd hock your house to own one.  

Best,

Bill

P.S. Edited to add that the seller's "think it was converted" comment is troubling. While there was, I think, some sort of tappet recall for early 8v's, the roller changeover postdates by a couple of years, I think, his purchase from M-I.

That's a generous offer, Bill, and one I'd be tempted to take take you up on. You might reconsider when I tell you the last time I owned a bike was in 1998 I've ridden occasionally since, but in the interest of full disclosure...

muzhik wrote:

That's a generous offer, Bill, and one I'd be tempted to take take you up on.  You might reconsider when I tell you the last time I owned a bike was in 1998  I've ridden occasionally since, but in the interest of full disclosure...

No problem.  I'll just attach the training wheels.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Bill

P.S.  Check your PM's.

Bill Hagan wrote:

muzhik wrote:

That's a generous offer, Bill, and one I'd be tempted to take take you up on.  You might reconsider when I tell you the last time I owned a bike was in 1998  I've ridden occasionally since, but in the interest of full disclosure...

No problem.  I'll just attach the training wheels.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Bill

P.S.  Check your PM's.

Deal!

I hit you back via PM

muzhik wrote:

He answered in the not-completely-committal "almost certain" it was converted, but call Dave at MI to double-check.  

I'm with Bill. This comment alone cries suspicion. It's a bit head-in-sand. For the sake of a couple of minutes to pull a valve cover and say 'yes' or 'no' to confirm. It provides both parties with a solid reference point for bargaining. If he's a committed seller, he should be doing all to make a sale. Just my 2¢.

Sorry, I haven't been able to gather whether this bike is a Tenni Green SE or not? If it is then it is definitely a flattie UNLESS its been converted and that should of been recorded. Anyway, checking is very easy simply requiring the tappet cover be removed. If the owner won't agree to this? Run away!

Pete

Pete Roper wrote:

Sorry, I haven't been able to gather whether this bike is a Tenni Green SE or not? If it is then it is definitely a flattie UNLESS its been converted and that should of been recorded. Anyway, checking is very easy simply requiring the tappet cover be removed. If the owner won't agree to this? Run away!

Pete

It is, Pete. So are you saying there were no Tenni Green SE's that were factory rollers, to your knowledge? Were all of the Tenni SEs built by the 4/2012 cutoff date (found in older threads over on wildguzzi), or is that date not in fact accurate?

Copy/paste from this nearly 3 year old thread on wildguzzi:

Quote from: Curtis Harper on February 24, 2013, 10:20:59 AM
According to Piaggio, Roller tappets are in the following engines.

Stelvio AC : After AC12596 03/12/2012
GRiSO A8 : After 13524 04/12/2012
Norge AA : After 12214 04/18/2012

Thanks for that.

Pete

Nope, all the green Tenis were flatties.

Pete Roper wrote:

Nope, all the green Tenis were flatties.

Thanks for the info.  I shall cease my fruitless search for a factory roller tenni